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RECENT POSTS IN THIS TOPIC

Steve Dufourny: on 8/27/22 at 18:11pm UTC, wrote Hi Jim, it is not easy to explain this consciousness. It is a problem...

jim hughes: on 8/26/22 at 1:53am UTC, wrote I think "integrated information" might turn out to be an indication of...

Steve Dufourny: on 8/16/22 at 17:14pm UTC, wrote Hi , the problem is complex considering this consciousness. There are...

jim h: on 8/16/22 at 16:22pm UTC, wrote "One approach is to recognize that [...] a conscious experience depends on...



FQXi FORUM
December 6, 2022

ARTICLE: Quanthoven's Fifth [back to article]
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jim h wrote on Aug. 16, 2022 @ 16:22 GMT
"One approach is to recognize that [...] a conscious experience depends on the ability of a system to generate integrated information."

And that, of course, is just an unproven assumption, and one that many don't share. So I have a problem with the use of "recognize" in that sentence.

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Steve Dufourny replied on Aug. 16, 2022 @ 17:14 GMT
Hi , the problem is complex considering this consciousness. There are deeper parameters to consider at my opinion that just our actual reasonings. The fact to consider the main primary informations in this vacuum of the DE probably are esse ntial also and the fact to consider maybe an infinite eternal consciousness in 0D cresating this universe. The actual knowledges about the QM, the QFT , the theory of informations are too much limited . Even with the ideas of Penrose about the collapses of the waves functions and the microtubules, we need really to go deeper in philosophy and about deeper scalar fields which are probably beyond this general relativity . Many confound the intelligence and the algorythms with the consciousness.

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jim hughes replied on Aug. 26, 2022 @ 01:53 GMT
I think "integrated information" might turn out to be an indication of cosciousness - but not its cause. If it ever becomes possible to look at the information content of a brain and say something accurate about the state of consciousness, that could be very useful. But to then claim that consciousness has been explained would be basically assuming a conclusion.

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Steve Dufourny replied on Aug. 27, 2022 @ 18:11 GMT
Hi Jim, it is not easy to explain this consciousness. It is a problem philosophical also and in seeing our limitations physical, mathematical and philosophical , that is why it is a hard problem. I have read and learnt many papers about this consciousness, I like the ideas of Penrose and Hameroff , but it lacks things due to these limitations, the orchestrated objective reduction and the collapses of the waves function more the biological mechanism of brains are limited even in considering these neurons and microtubules. I told to Hameroff that there many deeper parameters to add . It depends also of this philosophy, many consider only the GR and photons like primary essence and god or mathematical accident they believe that the fields and waves are mainly the cause of all , and after they consider the vacuum of this GR for deeper informations and even the consciousness.If the DE and DM must be considered and mainly the main informations of this antigravitation and after even a kind of infinite eternal consciousness in 0D, so they shall not reach this consciousness because they just analyse the surface of problem. There is an enormous difference between this intelligence and the consciousness. I d say even that the body mind soul problem is a kind of key more the general philosophy of origin of the universe.

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