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What Is “Fundamental”
October 28, 2017 to January 22, 2018
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How can mindless mathematical laws give rise to aims and intention?
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Trick or Truth: The Mysterious Connection Between Physics and Mathematics
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How Should Humanity Steer the Future?
January 9, 2014 - August 31, 2014
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It From Bit or Bit From It
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Which of Our Basic Physical Assumptions Are Wrong?
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Is Reality Digital or Analog?
November 2010 - February 2011
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What's Ultimately Possible in Physics?
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RECENT POSTS IN THIS TOPIC

Lorraine Ford: on 3/25/18 at 1:13am UTC, wrote Brian, Thanks for reading my essay. Re “information is not just...

Brian Josephson: on 3/22/18 at 12:02pm UTC, wrote Hi Lorraine, I thought I should check out your own essay, and have now...

Vladimir Rogozhin: on 2/26/18 at 11:07am UTC, wrote Dear Lorraine, Excellent deep analytical essays with very important...

Steven Andresen: on 2/22/18 at 7:42am UTC, wrote Dear Lorraine If you are looking for another essay to read and rate in the...

Lorraine Ford: on 2/20/18 at 21:52pm UTC, wrote This is my comment on Brian Josephson's essay, which I posted on his essay...

Satyavarapu Gupta: on 2/6/18 at 20:24pm UTC, wrote Dear Lorraine Ford Wonderful deduction..."The universe creates and...

Dizhechko Semyonovich: on 1/28/18 at 18:59pm UTC, wrote Lorraine Ford, it's possible that you like to look at the sky and it seems...

Francesco D'Isa: on 1/27/18 at 13:12pm UTC, wrote Dear Lorraine, I really appreciated your interesting essay. You conclude...


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FQXi FORUM
October 23, 2019

CATEGORY: FQXi Essay Contest - Spring, 2017 [back]
TOPIC: The Creative Universe by Lorraine Ford [refresh]
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Author Lorraine Ford wrote on Jan. 26, 2018 @ 16:21 GMT
Essay Abstract

The universe creates and perceives its own information. Creation and perception are fundamental.

Author Bio

Lorraine is a former computer analyst and programmer. She lives with her husband, three ducks, and a wild flowering garden beloved by birds, bees and other insects. Lorraine is interested in animals, flowers, plants, insects and other living things, and the nature of reality.

Download Essay PDF File

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Joe Fisher wrote on Jan. 26, 2018 @ 17:28 GMT
Dear Lorraine Ford,

Reliable evidence exists that proves that the surface of the earth was formed millions of years before man and his utterly complex finite informational systems ever appeared on that surface. It logically follows that Nature must have permanently devised the only single physical construct of earth allowable.

Joe Fisher, Realist

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Author Lorraine Ford replied on Jan. 26, 2018 @ 20:32 GMT
Dear Joe,

I think I agree with you. Thanks for reading my essay.

Lorraine

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Jonathan J. Dickau wrote on Jan. 26, 2018 @ 18:11 GMT
Hi Lorraine,

I think you will find yourself in fundamental agreement with Brian Josephson, and should check out his essay at your earliest convenience. I got to see his lecture at FFP15, this past November, and already at that time thought that you and he would find a lot to agree on - if you ever had the opportunity for a conversation. I think he would also be gratified to know there are people like you who think life should not be excluded from the picture in Physics.

All the Best,

Jonathan

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Author Lorraine Ford replied on Jan. 26, 2018 @ 20:39 GMT
Hi Jonathan,

Thanks for reading my essay. I will check out Brian Josephson's essay.

Lorraine

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Author Lorraine Ford replied on Feb. 20, 2018 @ 21:52 GMT
This is my comment on Brian Josephson's essay, which I posted on his essay page:

Lorraine Ford wrote on Feb. 20, 2018 @ 21:30 GMT

Dear Professor Josephson,

I agree that meaning is fundamental, though I would argue that it is subjective meaning (corresponding to subjective information) that is fundamental to the way the universe works.

In the Notes [10] you say: “…Yardley writes … : “There is a symbolic man, in mind, which is the idea of man, which had to be present somewhere hidden (imaginary, an idea) before man could appear”. This assertion recalls analogous facts such as the fact that, for example, the idea of a computer had to be present in someone’s mind before computers could come into existence.”

This is an example of how your essay seems to assume absolute, objective meanings for signs and symbols, i.e. the essay seems to assume the existence of a Platonic realm. But a Platonic realm is never mentioned in the essay except in the References section (the book chapter What can music tell us about the nature of the mind? A Platonic Model, Josephson, B.D. and T. Carpenter (1996a), in Stuart R. Hameroff, Alfred W. Kaszniak & Alwyn C. Scott (eds.), Toward a Science of Consciousness, MIT).

I would have liked you to mention the Platonic realm assumption upfront, because a Platonic realm is an assumption that the universe itself is a poor, incomplete thing that needs something external like a God or a Platonic realm to bring it to life. I believe that this type of view is an insidiously damaging and inherently disrespectful way to view our universe, a view that has real consequences for the way we treat the Earth and it’s living things.

Best wishes,

Lorraine Ford

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Author Lorraine Ford wrote on Jan. 26, 2018 @ 20:43 GMT
Note to readers of my essay:

Thanks in advance for reading, and for any comments you might make about my essay.

Due to my commitments, I’m sorry that I will not be able to reply to comments, or to read and review any other essays.

Lorraine

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Francesco D'Isa wrote on Jan. 27, 2018 @ 13:12 GMT
Dear Lorraine,

I really appreciated your interesting essay. You conclude that:

> The creation of information and the perception of information are fundamental aspects of the universe that are not themselves information. Information is what is created and what is perceived. Only information can be symbolically represented.

I found some interesting points in common with my essay about absolute relativism. My text indeed could be partially read as a consequence of your quote.

Well written and enjoyable, I wish you luck!

Francesco

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Dizhechko Boris Semyonovich wrote on Jan. 28, 2018 @ 18:59 GMT
Lorraine Ford, it's possible that you like to look at the sky and it seems to you an empty endless space in which large and small bodies move. However, this impression is deceptive. According to the principle of the identity of space and matter of Descartes, space is matter that moves. When Copernicus began to assert that the Earth revolves around the Sun, he had, according to Descartes, to add that along with the Earth around the Sun, the entire circumsolar space rotates. Space is what the whole world is built of. Space is the source of information. Look at my essay in which I showed how radically the physics can change if it follows this principle. Leave your autograph there.

Sincerely, Dizhechko Boris Semyonovich.

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Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta wrote on Feb. 6, 2018 @ 20:24 GMT
Dear Lorraine Ford

Wonderful deduction..."The universe creates and perceives its own information. Creation and perception are fundamental.".... in very few words....!

By the way...

Here in my essay energy to mass conversion is proposed...……..….. yours is very nice essay best wishes …. I highly appreciate hope your essay and hope for reciprocity ….You may please spend...

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Steven Andresen wrote on Feb. 22, 2018 @ 07:42 GMT
Dear Lorraine

If you are looking for another essay to read and rate in the final days of the contest, will you consider mine please? I read all essays from those who comment on my page, and if I cant rate an essay highly, then I don’t rate them at all. Infact I haven’t issued a rating lower that ten. So you have nothing to lose by having me read your essay, and everything to...

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Vladimir Rogozhin wrote on Feb. 26, 2018 @ 11:07 GMT
Dear Lorraine,

Excellent deep analytical essays with very important conclusions that give directions for overcoming the crisis of understanding in the foundation of science:

- «Time can only exist if there is a relationship or a connection between information change and time, i.e. if time itself is an information category. Any “perception” by the universe, that number...

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Brian D. Josephson wrote on Mar. 22, 2018 @ 12:02 GMT
Hi Lorraine,

I thought I should check out your own essay, and have now got round to doing it. The first point is that you are in effect taking a semiotic viewpoint, i.e. that information is not just information, but information for something (cf. also Bohm and Hiley's 'active information'). I would however say that the something is 'something in the universe' as opposed to the universe itself (related to your 'point of view'), and the fact that such things exist is related to their effective use of information. When you talk of numbers and algorithms you are probably referring to that aspect of process that is stable and can be reduced to clearly specifiable forms, but that is not all that such agencies can do.

While I don't agree with what you write in its entirety, I think your essay does have important ideas in it and I'll be thinking about how one can progress from here.

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Author Lorraine Ford replied on Mar. 25, 2018 @ 01:13 GMT
Brian,

Thanks for reading my essay.

Re “information is not just information, but information for something…'something in the universe' as opposed to the universe itself”: Yes, I contend that it is parts of the universe (particles to living things), not the whole universe, that create and experience information: “The primary substance (particles), and the characteristics of the primary substance (they create and perceive information), are the most fundamental aspects of the universe: these aspects can never be explained as being derived from information”.

But I would disagree with the statement: “the fact that such things exist is related to their effective use of information”. I might contend that the universe exists as small semi-independent parts, rather than an undivided whole, because the universe “perceived” that there is far more potential for creativity and experience in a universe of parts. (Of course, that would sound quite ridiculous to most people). These parts of the whole retain a strong tendency for coherence, where coherence seemingly must have existed before any information relationships were ever created.

Re numbers and algorithms: I contend that numbers are information relationships, just like laws of nature are information relationships. But I would think that any complexity of algorithmic information requires a corresponding complexity of structure i.e. atoms, molecules and living things, rather than particles.

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