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RECENT POSTS IN THIS TOPIC

CS Unnikrishnan: on 8/7/13 at 19:29pm UTC, wrote Dear Paul, That is really superhuman - all 180 essays! Thank you very much...

Paul Borrill: on 8/7/13 at 19:08pm UTC, wrote Dear Professor Unnikrishnan, I have now finished reviewing all 180 essays...

CS Unnikrishnan: on 8/6/13 at 9:03am UTC, wrote Dear Ram, I will try to read the paper in the arXive before discussing....

Anonymous: on 8/6/13 at 8:58am UTC, wrote Dear Sreenath, Thanks for your kind message. First let me clarify my claim...

Sreenath N: on 8/6/13 at 7:14am UTC, wrote Dear prof. Unnikrishnan, In your highly intriguing article, you have...

Ram Vishwakarma: on 8/4/13 at 20:14pm UTC, wrote Dear Unnikrishnan, You have mentioned about...

eAmazigh HANNOU: on 8/4/13 at 20:05pm UTC, wrote Dear CS Unnikrishnan, We are at the end of this essay contest. In...

CS Unnikrishnan: on 8/4/13 at 12:23pm UTC, wrote Dear Hector, Thanks for your message. I read the summary, and will read...


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FQXi FORUM
October 23, 2019

CATEGORY: It From Bit or Bit From It? Essay Contest (2013) [back]
TOPIC: Matter and its Configuration States in the Making of Information by CS Unnikrishnan [refresh]
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Author CS Unnikrishnan wrote on Jul. 3, 2013 @ 13:08 GMT
Essay Abstract

I present compelling arguments for the ontological primacy of matter in the nature of physical reality, by examining the premises of creation, existence and dissolution of information. A clear distinction between matter and its physical states that translates to the distinction between bits and their information states is established to arrive at this result, directly from requirements of quantum measurement. Then it is shown that this alone allows the exponential measure of the information potential of a finite amount of matter. En route the argument, I point out that the consistency of black hole thermodynamics also requires the ontological priority of matter over information. I conclude with a discussion of the universe as matter and its self-referential information landscape.

Author Bio

C. S. Unnikrishnan is professor of physics at the Tata Institute of Fundamental Research. His research interests and experimental and theoretical aspects of foundational issues in gravity and quantum physics. The experimental expertise spans the range of precision measurements employing torsion balances, interferometers, and spectroscopy of laser cooled atoms and BEC. Major theoretical contributions are a new theory of dynamics and relativity determined by cosmic gravity (Cosmic Relativity) and clarifications on the relations between fundamental conservation laws and quantum correlations upholding Einstein locality. He is a key member of the IndIGO consortium and the Indian gravitational wave detector initiatives.

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James Lee Hoover wrote on Jul. 3, 2013 @ 20:18 GMT
CS Unnikrishnan,

If given the time and the wits to evaluate over 120 more entries, I have a month to try. My seemingly whimsical title, “It’s good to be the king,” is serious about our subject.

Jim

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Zoran Mijatovic wrote on Jul. 4, 2013 @ 07:50 GMT
Hello Prof. Unnikrishnan

I found your essay both interesting and generally precise in its exposition; however, in some areas it was unexpectedly less clear, indeed, on one occasion it was almost unintelligible; and I quote:

"Hence the key concepts are specification of a physical state of the physical system whose dynamics is monitored and that of the external world."...

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Author CS Unnikrishnan replied on Jul. 4, 2013 @ 09:35 GMT
Zoran,

Thanks for the comments. Perhaps that sentence was not good enough to express clearly. The idea is that specification or preparation of a physical state of a material system requires A physical state of the external world (in a limited sense) also to be specified, whether it is a coordinate system, basis, apparatus etc. For example, saying that the electron's spin is up (its physical state) makes sense only when the notion "up" in the external world is also specified. So, the information content of the state is a correlation between the specification of a physical state of the system and a physical state for the external world. As long as one is limited to stating the correlation, the entire picture (system + world) can be transformed together. But, clearly, what is implicit is that there is an infinite chain of these specifications! State of the (limited) external world, like the coordinate system, cannot be specified without referring to another coordinate system, etc...One is perhaps led to the philosophical need for an absolute system of reference. Or one can just stick to correlations as the satisfactory specification of the physical state and thus of information (without mentioning separately the state of the system and that of the reference). In either case, both the physical system being observed and the reference system consist of matter. If one subscribes to an absolute reference, it then has to be the matter-filled universe and not empty space.

I hope I have clarified what I meant in that sentence, and a bit more.

Unnikrishnan

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Zoran Mijatovic replied on Jul. 7, 2013 @ 05:40 GMT
Professor Unnikrishnan,

Thank you for the clarification.

Best Regards.

Zoran.

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Sreenath B N wrote on Jul. 4, 2013 @ 08:13 GMT
Dear Prof. Unnikrishnan,

I have down loaded your essay and soon post my comments on it. Meanwhile, please, go through my essay and post your comments.

Regards and good luck in the contest.

Sreenath BN.

http://fqxi.org/community/forum/topic/1827

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Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta wrote on Jul. 4, 2013 @ 12:02 GMT
Dear Prof Unnikrishnan,

Thank you for preparing a Excellent essay. So you think Dynamic States of matter are important, thinking of taking into consideration Newtonian gravitation into consideration, Well and very good.

But why do you want to take into consideration some Blackhole thermo dynamics. Blackholes are just mathematical singularities. They were not found in Astronomy or in...

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Michael Helland wrote on Jul. 4, 2013 @ 20:03 GMT
Very much liked that you put matter, space and time together. To me, spacetime highlights the intertwiningof space an time but leaves out matter.

Maybe it should be called spacetimematter.

The reason consciousness may be excluded from the laws of physics is because the laws of physics are but patterns in the measurements produced by observers.

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Hoang cao Hai wrote on Jul. 5, 2013 @ 02:50 GMT
Dear CS Unnikrishnan

An essay discussing the broad scale but still focus on the main subject - however your measures to solve for problem is quite difficult to prove in practice - is nonetheless interesting when read it.

And to change the atmosphere "abstract" of the competition and to demonstrate for the real preeminent possibility of the Absolute theory as well as to clarify the...

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Anton Lorenz Vrba wrote on Jul. 5, 2013 @ 09:57 GMT
Dear Prof Unnikrishnan,

I find it difficult to give any constructive comment/critique to your essay; in general you have echoed the contemporary paradigm but that is also good.

I for one cannot agree with the contemporary paradigm and thus we could debate, however this debate is not granted to me. I thus challenge you as a teacher to explain the space-time information paradox in the same context as you explain to your students the twin, Ehrenfest, ladder-and-barn, etc paradoxes are in effect not paradoxical.

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basudeba mishra wrote on Jul. 10, 2013 @ 01:33 GMT
Dear Sir,

You have correctly pointed out that “Newton could not present the arena of space and time for dynamics without referring to matter.” This is because space and time are the intervals of objects (matter confining energy) and events (energy acting on matter) respectively and these two are inseparable complements. There is nothing like bare charge or bare mass. In this sense...

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George Kirakosyan wrote on Jul. 10, 2013 @ 04:54 GMT
DEAR PROFESSOR,

I WELCOME YOUR WORK AS ONE OF BEST!

GEORGE K.

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Armin Nikkhah Shirazi wrote on Jul. 13, 2013 @ 22:03 GMT
Dear Professor Unnikrishnan,

In your essay, you eloquently argue several points which I believe more people should consider when thinking about foundational issues like the relation between information and matter.

As I was reading your essay, I was frankly struck by how much it appears that the fundamental concepts I hold that shape my worldview are similar to yours. Take for...

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Antony Ryan wrote on Jul. 15, 2013 @ 04:34 GMT
Dear Professor Unnikrishnan,

I like how you've highlighted that in both classical and quantum physics the importance of an observer's role. I also appreciate any piece of literature which explains infinite regress so well, as I'm a huge pupil of cosmogony and am working on a theory of everything that addresses the three paradoxes of existence.

As an aside though I have entered this contest, so although not this precise area, it touches upon Black holes, entropy and observation and transmission of information. Also the Fiboancci sequence - hope you take a look.

I think you've explained your argument for matter's place of supremacy over information well.

Excellent essay - well done!

Best wishes,

Antony

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Joe Fisher wrote on Jul. 18, 2013 @ 16:53 GMT
Professor Unnikrishnan,

Please forgive me. I am a decrepit old realist and unlike your abstract reality that appears to come in three abstract levels, my unique realty only occur, once.

As I have explained in my essay BITTERS: The real Universe only deals in absolutes. All information is abstract and all and every abstract part of information is excruciatingly difficult to understand. Information is always selective, subjective and sequential. Reality is not and cannot ever be selective subjective and sequential.

One (1) real unique Universe can only be eternally occurring in one real here and now while perpetually traveling at one real “speed” of light through one real infinite dimension once. One is the absolute of everything. (1) is the absolute of number. Real is the absolute of being. Universe is the absolute of energy. Eternal is the absolute of duration. Occurring is the absolute of action. Here and now are absolutes of location and time. Perpetual is the absolute of ever. Traveling is the absolute of conveyance method. Light is the absolute of speed. Infinite dimension is the absolute of distance and once is the absolute of history.

Wheeler ought to have asked the following questions:

Is the real Universe simple? Yes.

Is the abstract universe simple? No.

Is unique, once simple Yes.

Is quantum theory simple? No.

I do hope your fine essay does well in the competition.

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Manuel S Morales wrote on Jul. 29, 2013 @ 01:01 GMT
Dear C. S. Unnikrishnan,

I found your essay compelling and insightful. In your conclusion you mentioned about taking the map out of the city which I found to be the only way for me to evaluate the findings of a 12 year experiment I have recently concluded. Although you have a different approach to the essay topic than I do, I found your conclusion inspiring and most worthy of merit.

Best wishes,

Manuel

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Vladimir Rogozhin wrote on Jul. 31, 2013 @ 10:19 GMT
Dear Professor C.S. Unnikrishnan,

Contests FQXi - is primarily a new radical idea. "The trouble with physics" push ... In your essay given new ideas and conclusions. I especially like the radical dialectical materialist and a great lover of geography (before going to bed always looking maps and moved to life for 67 years -73 times from place to place), I liked your conclusion: " However, we...

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john stephan selye wrote on Aug. 2, 2013 @ 01:40 GMT
Having read so many insightful essays, I am probably not the only one to find that my views have crystallized, and that I can now move forward with growing confidence. I cannot exactly say who in the course of the competition was most inspiring - probably it was the continuous back and forth between so many of us. In this case, we should all be grateful to each other.

If I may, I'd like to...

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john stephan selye wrote on Aug. 2, 2013 @ 01:42 GMT
Dear sir,

I have posted the above general comment to everyone, but your essay has piqued my interest and I will return to it in two days and post a review. I will also rate it, of course.

Best wishes,

John Selye

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Héctor Daniel Gianni wrote on Aug. 2, 2013 @ 19:51 GMT
Dear CS Unnikrishnan :

I am an old physician and I don’t know nothing of mathematics and almost nothing of physics,

But maybe you would be interested in my essay over a subject which after the common people, physic discipline is the one that uses more than any other, the so called “time”. No one that I...

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Author CS Unnikrishnan replied on Aug. 4, 2013 @ 12:23 GMT
Dear Hector,

Thanks for your message. I read the summary, and will read your essay soon (your English is indeed difficult!)

Just as a short comment, seeing time as motion is certainly correct. Of course it is better to use the more general term, 'evolution' because mechanical motion is just one kind of evolution. In that sense all sensible time is a comparison (or correlation) of motion against motion.

Regards,

Unnikrishnan

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eAmazigh M. HANNOU wrote on Aug. 4, 2013 @ 20:05 GMT
Dear CS Unnikrishnan,

We are at the end of this essay contest.

In conclusion, at the question to know if Information is more fundamental than Matter, there is a good reason to answer that Matter is made of an amazing mixture of eInfo and eEnergy, at the same time.

Matter is thus eInfo made with eEnergy rather than answer it is made with eEnergy and eInfo ; because eInfo is eEnergy, and the one does not go without the other one.

eEnergy and eInfo are the two basic Principles of the eUniverse. Nothing can exist if it is not eEnergy, and any object is eInfo, and therefore eEnergy.

And consequently our eReality is eInfo made with eEnergy. And the final verdict is : eReality is virtual, and virtuality is our fundamental eReality.

Good luck to the winners,

And see you soon, with good news on this topic, and the Theory of Everything.

Amazigh H.

I rated your essay.

Please visit My essay.

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Ram Gopal Vishwakarma wrote on Aug. 4, 2013 @ 20:14 GMT
Dear Unnikrishnan,

You have mentioned about Hawking’s result in your essay. As we know, the quantization of the right hand side of Einstein’s equations, in a given spacetime, has yielded the effects of the Hawking radiation. Though the role of back reaction has not been fully taken care of here, let’s examine this result in another perspective. Recently it has been shown that the right hand side of Einstein’s equations, i.e., the energy-stress tensor T^{ik}, has serious problems [arXiv:1204.1553]. Hence, the results obtained by using it also become doubtful. Would you like to comment on this issue?

Best Regards.

___Ram

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Author CS Unnikrishnan replied on Aug. 6, 2013 @ 09:03 GMT
Dear Ram,

I will try to read the paper in the arXive before discussing. It certainly interests me since I am trying to understand some aspects of the gravitational energy momentum right now.

Unnikrishnan

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Sreenath B N wrote on Aug. 6, 2013 @ 07:14 GMT
Dear prof. Unnikrishnan,

In your highly intriguing article, you have clearly distinguished between matter and its physical states on one hand and also between bits and their information states on the other. You have substantiated it with your elegant logical arguments. According to you ‘matter is more fundamental than information’. So we can know of matter only through its physical...

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Anonymous replied on Aug. 6, 2013 @ 08:58 GMT
Dear Sreenath,

Thanks for your kind message. First let me clarify my claim that It is Bit - it is in fact not a very deep statement. I am just saying that just as one should distinguish between Matter and its physical state one should distinguish between a bit and its information state (matter is one entity and states could be many - so the same material entity is capable of transformation...

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Paul Borrill wrote on Aug. 7, 2013 @ 19:08 GMT
Dear Professor Unnikrishnan,

I have now finished reviewing all 180 essays for the contest and appreciate your contribution to this competition.

I have been thoroughly impressed at the breadth, depth and quality of the ideas represented in this contest. In true academic spirit, if you have not yet reviewed my essay, I invite you to do so and leave your comments.

You can find the latest version of my essay here:

http://fqxi.org/data/forum-attachments/Borrill-TimeOne-
V1.1a.pdf

(sorry if the fqxi web site splits this url up, I haven’t figured out a way to not make it do that).

May the best essays win!

Kind regards,

Paul Borrill

paul at borrill dot com

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Author CS Unnikrishnan replied on Aug. 7, 2013 @ 19:29 GMT
Dear Paul,

That is really superhuman - all 180 essays! Thank you very much for your message. I just downloaded your essay, but time might be up for us in the east since it already past midnight here and I will not finish reading before the time limit. Also, it deals with a lot of things and not easy reading. Yet, I will read soon.

Regards,

Unnikrishnan

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