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Vladimir Fedorov: on 4/9/17 at 7:08am UTC, wrote Dear Daniel, Many thanks for the kind words about my essay and high...

Daniel Rocha: on 4/7/17 at 16:12pm UTC, wrote Dear Vladimir, due time constrains (besides, the voting ends today), I...

Vladimir Fedorov: on 4/6/17 at 11:34am UTC, wrote Dear Daniel, With great interest I read your essay, which of course is...

Dizhechko Semyonovich: on 4/6/17 at 7:22am UTC, wrote Dear Daniel de França Diniz Rocha You have a wonderful, well-written...

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FQXi FORUM
August 18, 2017

CATEGORY: Wandering Towards a Goal Essay Contest (2016-2017) [back]
TOPIC: Long term stability and the meaning of life by Daniel de França Diniz Rocha [refresh]
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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha wrote on Mar. 3, 2017 @ 19:20 GMT
Essay Abstract

A new definition of life is given, which is sufficient to construct practical experiments to understand the origin of life. Stable mechanisms throughout evolution are discussed and their importance on human society are highlighted in the conclusion.

Author Bio

I have a BSc. in Physics, at the UFRJ, Rio de Janeiro, Brazil. I have worked with trademarks for the last 12 years, as a civil servant, at INPI.

Download Essay PDF File




Torsten Asselmeyer-Maluga wrote on Mar. 3, 2017 @ 20:03 GMT
Dear Daniel,

interesting topic of your essay. You try to grasp a topic which seem intractable.

I will have a look into your essay soon. My essay is the usage of quantum gravitational method to get a qualitative model of our brain. Maybe interested?

All the best

Torsten

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 3, 2017 @ 22:54 GMT
Sure, I am interested. I will take a look. In the meanwhile, since our last email conversation, I figured out the mathematical subjects I need, because of some curious numbers contained in some papers released last year.




Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha wrote on Mar. 3, 2017 @ 22:47 GMT
Sure, I am interested. I will take a look. In the meanwhile, since our last email conversation, I figured out the mathematical subjects I need, because of some curious numbers contained in some papers released last year.




Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha wrote on Mar. 3, 2017 @ 23:15 GMT
Dear Torsten,

I once thought about cognition being derived from closed loops. The reason for is since we are aware of many things, even if unconsciously, I think we are at least in very a neurotic and compulsive state of mind towards any kind of information. And, indeed, the circuitry of our brain is made of small loops, when information is kept stored, and large loops, which pass through...

view entire post





Rene Ahn wrote on Mar. 7, 2017 @ 13:55 GMT
Hi Daniel,

Just started reading your essay as promised in my own thread.

I am still thinking a bit about what you propose, not sure I completely get it.

You obviously know a lot more about chemistry than I do.

these BZ reactions are certainly interesting. What I do not quite understand though is whether there could be a mechanism that allows chemical loops like these to somehow accumulate information, so as to make some kind of progress towards, for instance, greater stability? Any thoughts?

I am looking for a kind of constructive feedback loop, I guess.

Any relationship between your ideas and the "containers first" school of thought?

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 7, 2017 @ 14:23 GMT
Hi Rene! Of course, I am looking for a great constructive feedback!

Yes, there is some sort of relationship with the container first. The container is the entire primitive ocean, or better layers of the ocean with different circulation paths.

The information is merely to stay bellow a certain level or above a certain level. This is too simple, but that's the most basic information life can carry without a system specialized in carrying information, like DNA. I tried to explain in the papaer how these informations could accumulate, that is, where currents would cross, they would mixture. In this case, more layers of control could accumulate.

Note that when currents meet, there is turbulance, so, this would be the first selecting pressure life, as I defined, would suffer. The selection would be, since there is no protection barrier to protect contents, like a cell, more sturd reaction would be selected. In this sense, a more stable reaction would "survive".

So, while currents of the ocean ciculated, this more complex reaction would be selected and spread to other currents. The overall chemichal composition of the oceans would change gradually because of these. There would be inputs from impacts from asteroids, input from volcanoes and so on. But, so, these would be inputs that would disturb the life as I put it, which would force them to gradually accumulate more and more complex reactions, that would further increase the chemistry of the oceans or many of its currents.

Note that deeper in the ocean, there are currents that passes through vents. But these are very turbulent, at a time, some very mechanism would be sturd enough enter one of those and begin to use the organic reactions there.




Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha wrote on Mar. 7, 2017 @ 14:22 GMT
Hi Rene! Of course, I am looking for a great constructive feedback!

Yes, there is some sort of relationship with the container first. The container is the entire primitive ocean, or better layers of the ocean with different circulation paths.

The information is merely to stay bellow a certain level or above a certain level. This is too simple, but that's the most basic information...

view entire post





adel sadeq wrote on Mar. 8, 2017 @ 01:12 GMT
Hi Daniel

Nice to see you at FQXI. You seem to have put a good effort into the essay so I am giving you a very good mark. My essay as you know is my old theory. I have made an excellent progress although I have not been feeling well so I have cut back on the explanation.

the numbers are very easy to check via Wolfram.

http://fqxi.org/community/forum/topic/2884

Adel

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Rene Ahn wrote on Mar. 8, 2017 @ 01:19 GMT
Hi Daniel,

maybe I misunderstand. But, if these reactions "spread" they do so because they have a positive feedback loop, a bit like a wildfire (forest fire) or such? And you propose a repertoire of different autocatalytic reactions with different signatures? I really find it hard to see how any coonstruction is possible without "transgenerational" memory...

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 8, 2017 @ 01:42 GMT
Hi Rene,

Yes. Yes. There is no reproduction, as I tried to define life, I tried to highlight that= in the essay. It's like you say, "wildfire". But different "wildfires", which may burn on different types of tree, overlaps and may become dependent on one another or not. If they are, they "may be able" to spread to other types of trees.

I put on the technical note a type of reaction that is a mixture of two others. The different signatures, as you say, comes from different currents that input different chemicals.

This is not a memory, it is a self propagating pattern. It will only become memory, in the sense of storage of data separated from write/erase/copy, down the evolution line, when this "wildlife" reaches alkaline vents. This is where, I think, life as we know came up to be.

Life, as I defined in the beginning can be thought of the ecosystem in its entirety, where each organism, on each niche, tries to gather energy. So, the "wildfire" continues, but in much more specialized parts, like in individual animals, plants, bacteria, and so on.




Erik P Hoel wrote on Mar. 8, 2017 @ 15:44 GMT
Hey Daniel, it's Erik P Hoel ("Agent Above, Atom Below") - thanks for linking me here. You asked me to comment on notions of stability, on which I completely agree with you as you say "That life is all about control and stability, adapted to a random environment and that it tries to stay as close as possible to a predictable pattern equilibrium, even if it shows a non trivial behavior."

I'd completely agree, but add in that there can be causal stability (the stability of causal relationships) as well as what people think of as normal physical stability.

Thanks for the essay!

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 8, 2017 @ 15:59 GMT
Yes, sure, there are causal relations! That's why I put arrows, to indicate the diraction of chemical reactions. Also, because also tried to highlight structures that are stable with time. I wanted to speak about the mRNA, but I also wanted to talk about evolution... So, I ended up talking about the signals that pattern most of the animals.

If you have anything more to say, please, do it! I am also here to learn and enrich my ideas with the ones of other people!



Joe Fisher replied on Mar. 9, 2017 @ 17:19 GMT
Dear Daniel de França Diniz Rocha,

Please excuse me for I have no intention of disparaging in any way any part of your essay.

I merely wish to point out that “Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler.” Albert Einstein (1879 - 1955) Physicist & Nobel Laureate.

Only nature could produce a reality so simple, a single cell amoeba could deal with it.

The real Universe must consist only of one unified visible infinite physical surface occurring in one infinite dimension, that am always illuminated by infinite non-surface light.

A more detailed explanation of natural reality can be found in my essay, SCORE ONE FOR SIMPLICITY. I do hope that you will read my essay and perhaps comment on its merit.

Joe Fisher, Realist

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 9, 2017 @ 17:34 GMT
Dear Joe Fisher,

“Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler.” That's my intention, indeed, with the essay. In this case, I deal with the problems dealt with the cornerstones of evolution, mainly the beginning, the origin. The proposal for chemical clocks is quite complicated in itself, as you can check in the additional notes and references. All you can do is approximate set of approximate chemical equations, which describe quite well the mechanism, but secondary products might be left out. I also made some simplified arguments using arrows on section 2, in order to show how to deal with the most important operators or regulators of the reaction.

The problem it is that the usual programs are extremely complicated and do not have a realistic expectation of a path from "primitive soup" to a cell. So, as you can see in the abstract, what I propose is more in the direction of an invitation to a new experimental program.




Héctor Daniel Gianni wrote on Mar. 9, 2017 @ 19:39 GMT
Dear Daniel de Franca Diniz Rocha

I invite you and every physicist to read my work “TIME ORIGIN,DEFINITION AND EMPIRICAL MEANING FOR PHYSICISTS, Héctor Daniel Gianni ,I’m not a physicist.

How people interested in “Time” could feel about related things to the subject.

1) Intellectuals interested in Time issues usually have a nice and creative wander for the unknown.

2) They usually enjoy this wander of their searches around it.

3) For millenniums this wander has been shared by a lot of creative people around the world.

4) What if suddenly, something considered quasi impossible to be found or discovered such as “Time” definition and experimental meaning confronts them?

5) Their reaction would be like, something unbelievable,… a kind of disappointment, probably interpreted as a loss of wander…..

6) ….worst than that, if we say that what was found or discovered wasn’t a viable theory, but a proved fact.

7) Then it would become offensive to be part of the millenary problem solution, instead of being a reason for happiness and satisfaction.

8) The reader approach to the news would be paradoxically adverse.

9) Instead, I think it should be a nice welcome to discovery, to be received with opened arms and considered to be read with full attention.

11)Time “existence” is exclusive as a “measuring system”, its physical existence can’t be proved by science, as the “time system” is. Experimentally “time” is “movement”, we can prove that, showing that with clocks we measure “constant and uniform” movement and not “the so called Time”.

12)The original “time manuscript” has 23 pages, my manuscript in this contest has only 9 pages.

I share this brief with people interested in “time” and with physicists who have been in sore need of this issue for the last 50 or 60 years.

Héctor

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 10, 2017 @ 04:03 GMT
I will read it, sure. But, can you give me a link to the full manuscript?




John Edward LaMuth wrote on Mar. 10, 2017 @ 03:29 GMT
Daniel

Very ambitious and insightful scope of research

kudos

John L

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 10, 2017 @ 04:02 GMT
Thank you! I will try to improve my understanding of the working of my brain and read your paper and your site. The usual books I try to access seem to descriptive instead of trying any attempt of explanation. Explanations are often left to the bio mechanical and physiological parts of the organism.




Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta wrote on Mar. 11, 2017 @ 04:22 GMT
Nice essay Rocha,

Nice new definition for life you gave, I don’t know life sciences….

So, coming back to the initial premises, that the purpose of life is to propagate a chemical reaction and its aim to self regulate, notice that the absence of reproduction in the definition of life as well as the capability of reproduction. That’s because, a priori, there is nothing that stops...

view entire post


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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 11, 2017 @ 15:42 GMT
You got me interested! I will surely take a look!



Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta replied on Mar. 12, 2017 @ 23:40 GMT
Dear Rocha,

Thank you for such nice interest and visiting my essay. I am writing a reply now for your esteemed comments on my essay there, Please have a look...

Best Regards

=snp

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Anonymous wrote on Mar. 11, 2017 @ 15:40 GMT
You got me interested! I will surely take a look!

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Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta replied on Mar. 13, 2017 @ 00:08 GMT
Dear Daniel de França Diniz Rocha ,

I am just repeating my reply here....

…………..Reply……………….

Thank you for your valuable time and interest, we will work together no problem

…………… Your words……….

Your essay is hard to understand, but I think it is excellent.

…………..Reply……………….

Thank...

view entire post


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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 13, 2017 @ 13:04 GMT
What do you mean by before and after the big bang?



Satyavarapu Naga Parameswara Gupta replied on Mar. 31, 2017 @ 22:19 GMT
Dear Daniel de França Diniz Rocha

I am sorry I did not notice this, thank you for posting this on my essay....

Thank you for reading my essay.

That is a Good question.

There is no Bigbang according to Dynamic Universe Model. When I say BEFORE or AFTER Bigbang, it is the time frame to denote a point of time 13.8 gega years back. This is generally believed by Bigbang based cosmologists at that time there was a big explosion and Universe was started from that time.

Just to mention from that point of time I used those words “BEFORE or AFTER Bigbang”.

I hope this clears.

Best

=snp

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Torsten Asselmeyer-Maluga wrote on Mar. 13, 2017 @ 16:18 GMT
Dear Daniel,

as I stated above, interesting essay. For me, there wer esome jumps in your argumentation:

- You claimed that intention is given by the propagation of chemical clocks. Here I missed some steps to get this statement.

- Derived from this statement, that life is composded at least by a very primitive network of chemical clocks. I see that chemical clocks are needded to get a control about the chemical processes but it is not life by itself. You need structure formation driven by nonlinear interactions. (but I see your intention)

But I like some of your claims abou the connection of stability and topology or that membrans played a strong role in thze formation of life.

A good essay (which I voted highly above the average) with a lot to think about

Best

Torsten

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 13, 2017 @ 17:49 GMT
Dear Torsten,

There was no jump in the argument. There are 3 issues here.

1.The conditions of the primitive Earth already had the necessary ingredients for a chemical clock. The problem is, as I posted in the abstract, what I propose is a research path. So, in a sense, the first part of the essay is a research proposal.

2.The other is a linguistic one. Intention and aim are synonyms in usual language and intentionality is a very complicated philosophical term and only vaguely linked to intentinon. So, I looked for the philology of the words and I defined in the simplest terms what aim and intention are.

3.I defined life as a radically different thing from life as we know it. In a part of the essay I, indeed, post the expression, "life as we know it". The initial structure was purely abstract, chemical pathways. But this definition of like keep existing, as in the form of the entirety of the biosphere, and all its subsystems, ecosystems, are life forms by themselves. I argue that this is a type of Gaya hypothesis.




Edwin Eugene Klingman wrote on Mar. 23, 2017 @ 03:40 GMT
Dear Daniel,

Your essay is quite complex. I did very much appreciate your review of "The eight immortals of the animal kingdom", which is as concise a summary as I have seen. It certainly is as close to 'magic' as one can imagine, and does seem to defy evolution. You said you would explain it in the next session. Was your explanation that reproduction addresses the fact that the system will accumulate malfunctions and so makes a copy before it breaks down?

I can imagine big numbers like the next guy, but it's extremely difficult for me to envision random mutation 'inventing' this complexity. The growth of an organism is as miraculous is anything I can imagine. Thanks for describing key aspects of the process.

While the extended growth of topological organisms can be (in theory) described by math, it is not at all apparent that math has much to do with the process. You then extend the growth of organisms to societies and the 'invention' of mathematics to solve the attendant social organization issues, concluding that, "at the present time, mathematics cannot be disassociated from people." I agree with this perspective.

Similarly, while one can apply the words 'aims' and 'intentions' to the process, it is difficult to describe intention to the cell-based growth of multi-cellular organisms. The control issues are complex, and the fact that the same eight genes operate across a broad range of organisms is mind blowing. As I understand it, it is largely the frequency with which the gene is expressed that differentiates the structures.

At the end you mention the "extended Gaia hypothesis". I do not know the specifics of this hypothesis, but from what little I know, it would not seem to be unrelated to the consciousness field.

Thanks again for reminding us what goes on in order that you and I might live.

My best regards,

Edwin Eugene Klingman

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 23, 2017 @ 09:06 GMT
Dear Edwin,

I did not raised at all the issue of consciousness in my essay. I wrote about aims and intentions, from the point of view of the definition of life I gave. So, it was about the meaning of life.

The math part, I tried to make it clear in section 1,2 and in the additional notes. Section 1 and additional, it is about that the fundamental operation life can do is an...

view entire post




Edwin Eugene Klingman replied on Apr. 3, 2017 @ 21:11 GMT
Dear Daniel,

Forgive my delay in acknowledging your answers to my questions, and thank you for them. It is difficult to manage reading all the fine essays in this contest and time is short. I have read your essay twice and consider it an excellent contribution.

Good luck in the contest and my best wishes for you,

Edwin Eugene Klingman

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Lawrence B. Crowell wrote on Mar. 25, 2017 @ 20:27 GMT
Dear Daniel Rocha,

Your essay is thought provoking. You state that a coordinated clock is a necessary ingredient for life. In fact you say this defines life, which I am a bit uncertain on. However, a living system you maintain requires what might be called a master clock. This might be, though I am not sure about that status of research on this. On a larger and more complex scale, the brain has the alpha, beta etc waves which seem to serve as some coordinating the occurrence of action potentials or neural activity. On the cellular level this would imply the frequencies of various molecular processes form the set of possible time periodicities from which by complex coupling a single periodicity or frequency emerges.

I just just did a brief search on this or a related idea and did not find anything that seemed to match. This does make some sense. At least there should be the emergence of some regulating time keeping process in a biological system. I would think that some cell cycle regulating kinase or protein dependent kinase such as protein kinase A or cyclin dependent kinase linked to cell cycle. These are linked to cyclic forms of AMP and GMP, which in turn are purines at the core of molecular biology from DNA/RNA to cellular respiration. The cyclins are a then a class of proteins that are necessary for the regulation of the cell cycle, and these seem to be at the heart of anything approaching a cellular clock.

Cheers LC

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 30, 2017 @ 02:36 GMT
Dear LC,

I think that most of the cell reactions can be characterized as chemical clocks. As long as there is homeostasis, that is, that is, control parameters, there will be a clock of some kind, not even if is not regular in time. Like a thermostat. Not, that this is not the same of a random reaction, since in this case the chemical reaction will simply follow the 2nd law of...

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Wilhelmus de Wilde wrote on Mar. 28, 2017 @ 08:13 GMT
Dear Daniel,

At first I was intrigued by your title that includes "The meaning" of Life", as my essay is named "The Purpose of Life".

Then I started reading your essay and was happily surprised with the interpretations of the data available to our what I call "collective memory".

Your interpretations are deepening the understanding of our emergent reality.

You also indicate that "human beigs" represent the "conclusion" , one of the reasons you mention for this is the use of mathematics. Of course as we are humans, the "center" of our awareness is our consciousness. You are in the middele of a sphere where all information is simultaneously coming in (I call it the Subjective Simultaneity Sphere SSS)).

I agree with you when added : "It is also through mathematics that we (humans) are not only in the postion to procreate through biological progeneration but also through the creation of AI that would lead to a new form of consciousness. This could be the folow up of hunanity. hen we are really stepping up a rung on the ladder. This new form of consciousness may be able to teach us how to survive without killing others...and a system of organisation without the need of POWER...and suppression.

I enjoyed your essay very much and therfore gave it a high merit. I hope that my remarks will be interesting enough for you to read, surely comment and also give a rating to my essay : "The Purpose of Life".

best regards and good luck

Wilhelmus

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 29, 2017 @ 22:37 GMT
l de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 29, 2017 @ 22:36 GMT

Dear Wilhelmus,

I really loved your essay. In GR is also timeless, in that time is a dimension like the others. Given that what we have in GR are events, measured by a test particle, carrying a clock and a ruler, it really becomes an essential issue. This is a problem in that temporal paradoxes are created because the ordering of events, and so causality, become a confusing issue. Solution for this issues are avoided by imposing conditions which are not contained in the theory.

In QM, time is a parameter for coordinates or fields. This leads to complicated issues, unless you have a low dimensional system, like in 2 dimensions (say, string theory). But this goes awry quite quickly and there is no way to probe this kind of system in any conceivable known experiment.

So, you come up with an intriguing idea, an eternal now, that is, an eternal event. I think the eternal event, associated with the eternal now, is more fundamental than brains, plants, or whatever living beings, or particles, given that any particle (and thus any of those) has a discontinuous existence(the moment it interacts, it trades particles, so, if you check a Feynman diagram, it cannot be said to be the same). Then, you come up with the concept of SSS.

I would guess that this SSS is a sort of "condensate", a kind of 3d slice of the universe. While in GR there are no preferential slice due equivalence of observers, this SSS is living like "floating" on GR, perhaps with a universal time, which you call an emerging reality. This would be an extended object, where the eternal now is happening, emerging all the time. Perhaps a clue to this object is dark matter, since this emerging reality would interact with the gravitational field, making sure things stay in sync with a condensated surface with a unique universal time.



Wilhelmus de Wilde replied on Mar. 30, 2017 @ 15:27 GMT
Dear Daniel,

In the perception I devellopped there are no time-paradoxes. Even if one of the probabilities in TS is time-travel (and there is...). So...

You go back to a specific ENM from a specific time-life-line. The as then newly created life-line the evolves as a new one, while the old one still exists as an Eternal Now Moment. Kill your grandfather here and nothing happens to...

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 30, 2017 @ 19:43 GMT
I was trying to make it into a form that I could treat in terms of mathematics. Can you give me an idea?




Willy K wrote on Mar. 30, 2017 @ 08:16 GMT
Dear Daniel

You may very well be right about life being immersed in control systems, right from the bottom up dealing with cellular structure, all the way up to that of human society. “… controls case is fundamental. That life is all about control and stability, adapted to a random environment and that it tries to stay as close as possible to a predictable pattern equilibrium, even if it shows non trivial behavior.”

If you get the time, do check out the Good Regulator Theorem of Conant and the Law of Requisite Variety of Ashby. I think you might be able to find more parallels dealing with those laws from the biological world. I rate your essay very highly, despite the fact that I am not all that well versed in the biological and chemical terminologies. I could see that you have the big picture view correct, and the fine details surely must follow from that perspective.

Warm Regards, Willy

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Mar. 31, 2017 @ 02:12 GMT
Thank you very much for your feedback!




Peter Jackson wrote on Apr. 1, 2017 @ 18:10 GMT
Daniel,

A very interest, well written, well informed, unique and ambitious essay. I think you pulled it off well. I'm no expert in biology to judge those parts but I do have very similar biology to everyone else so think I'm qualify to give you a good score!

You mention the importance of feedback loops, which also identify as the key to cognitive decisions forming aims and intentions (but I then slip down to the more fundamental quantum scale architecture).

I think this certainly deserves to be a finalist.

Very best

Peter

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Apr. 3, 2017 @ 09:57 GMT
Dear Peter Jackson,

I really think you view of spin interaction as something interesting. The spin of the electron, as described by the Dirac equation, belongs to the group su(2), which is a double cover of so(3). That is, we need 2 rotations of a sphere. But people forget that these are different things and end up trying to talk about an electron as it were merely ONE very small sphere, tending to radius 0, mysteriously shifting its position up and down. Stephen Hawking did this confusion in his famous book brief history of time. People confuse the algebra if the group with the actual rotation of the electron. So, an electron is a 4 dimensional entity, since the Dirac equation obeys Lorentz transformations. So, people visualize the wrong situation, where the actual situation should be a hyperbolic sphere SO(3,1). And SO(3,1) is isomorphic so SU(2)XSU(2). This is why you needed 2 spheres to correctly explain the spin phenomena. I think you clarified a great deal of things, even for me.

Plus, you have added some great stuff along the way, which may help understand intelligence. Look at this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eas2zOSKIaQ

What is happening here it is that the slime molde, when it expands and pulsates, it is mimicking a non perturbation integral of a path integral. When you do non perturbative, you appeal to combinatoric methods, which are very compute intensive for usual computer architectures. I think our brains works in a way analogous to a slime mold, but it needs its parts more fixed, and not too fall apart, like it would happen to a slime mold. So, I think the brain works by expanding "pseudopods", and tries to find the food (the idea), and when it finds, it creates a synapse. As you can deduce from the slime mold examples, things will be stored like loops in the brain (indeed this is the case, and this is more clear in the relation ship between brain cortex and thalamus)




George Gantz wrote on Apr. 2, 2017 @ 16:12 GMT
Daniel - Thank you for an excellent essay. You are the only author I have read so far that defines "intention" correctly - as a direction or movement that is independent of agency. This is a critical distinction in any discussion of emergence that avoids the muddy waters of panpsychism.

I am curious if you have an opinion as to whether intention as you describe it in the biological realm may also apply to the chemical and the physical?

You may find some compatible themes in my essay The How and The Why of Emergence and Intention!

Cheers - George Gantz

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Apr. 4, 2017 @ 14:56 GMT
Dear George,

Thank you for the comment on my essay. Indeed there is a resemblance between your topic and mine. But I think while I went to a more evolutionary point of view, you went to a very beautiful poetic route. It indeed touched my heart seeing how, indeed, everything seem to self organized, despite the aparent lack of purpose in the universe, and that there is a sense of flow in all of that. This gives a reason to see purpose and not chaos to those who wishes to find a reason to exist, that our life has some value.

When you gave your grandsone as an example of the huge flow of love, as part of the universe's purpose in minimizing entropy, while exploring the environment, did made me a drop a couple of tears. It made me see through your eyes how something so simple can be an atom of the huge large scale principles of the universe.



George Gantz replied on Apr. 4, 2017 @ 18:22 GMT
Daniel - in case you do not have a chance to get back to your comment on my essay, here is my response:

"Thank you so very much for your kind remarks. I shed a tear writing about my grandson, too. Even better, I now have another grandson - one week old - and have been spending time with him as he slowly wakes to the wide world into which he was born. Yes, one can believe the world is deterministic, or completely random, or that our conscious sense of purpose, appreciation of beauty and experience of love is all epiphenomenal. But what a hollow waste that seems to be when we have the opportunity to embrace with all our hearts and our so very rational minds a delightful and joyous experiential and purposeful wonderland.

Many thanks - George

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Edward Kneller wrote on Apr. 3, 2017 @ 20:03 GMT
Daniel,

Thank you for the essay on intentions and living organisms. I was especially interested in your discussion of control and stability, which are fundamental aspects of not only individual organisms, but also the generational changes (evolution) that eventually lead to new species.

Your conclusion states, ‘...we can say that any society of organisms is, to a large extent, an organism itself. It may vary in complexity from a spectrum that includes parasitism, cooperation, colony up to a multicellular being (from the perspective of individual cells). Human societies can be seen as a type of organism and as such, it can be ascribed aims and intentions.’

Therefore, you may be interested in my essay, The Cosmic Odyssey of Matter, which formally defines and quantifies precise structures that include chemical elements, molecules, living organisms, and social groups. This formal definition shows how the whole human population is a precise structure, systematically assembled from smaller components.

link to The Cosmic Odyssey of Matter

Regards, Ed Kneller

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha replied on Apr. 4, 2017 @ 15:05 GMT
Dear Edward Kneller,

I make the words of Prof. Ellis mine. But I would like to to add that you actually uncover a very interesting complexity relation between all scales. It would be interesting to figure out if there is any relation to other scale relations, for example, Kolmogorov microscales.

Another very interesting thing is to estimate the number of civilizations in our galaxy and the rate of how many of them appear along the eras. Do you think that is possible?




Dizhechko Boris Semyonovich wrote on Apr. 5, 2017 @ 05:24 GMT
Dear Daniel de França Diniz Rocha

I appreciate your essay. You spent a lot of effort to write it. If you believed in the principle of identity of space and matter of Descartes, then your essay would be even better. There is not movable a geometric space, and is movable physical space. These are different concepts.

I inform all the participants that use the online translator, therefore, my essay is written badly. I participate in the contest to familiarize English-speaking scientists with New Cartesian Physic, the basis of which the principle of identity of space and matter. Combining space and matter into a single essence, the New Cartesian Physic is able to integrate modern physics into a single theory. Let FQXi will be the starting point of this Association.

Don't let the New Cartesian Physic disappear! Do not ask for himself, but for Descartes.

New Cartesian Physic has great potential in understanding the world. To show potential in this essay I risked give "The way of the materialist explanation of the paranormal and the supernatural" - Is the name of my essay.

Visit my essay and you will find something in it about New Cartesian Physic. After you give a post in my topic, I shall do the same in your theme

Sincerely,

Dizhechko Boris

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Dizhechko Boris Semyonovich replied on Apr. 6, 2017 @ 07:22 GMT
Dear Daniel de França Diniz Rocha

You have a wonderful, well-written essay. Your assertion that life originated as a result of the fact that under certain conditions the possibility of its occurrence increases as a geometric progression are very convincing. For me, claiming to be a physicist, stable existence of corpuscles is due to the fact that the rotation at the center reaches the speed of light. As is known from the theory of relativity in this case, the time almost stops.

I wish you success in the contest.

Sincerely,

Dizhechko Boris

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Vladimir Nikolaevich Fedorov wrote on Apr. 6, 2017 @ 11:34 GMT
Dear Daniel,

With great interest I read your essay, which of course is worthy of high rating. Excellently written.

You wrote

«I once thought about cognition being derived from closed loops.»

«And, indeed, the circuitry of our brain is made of small loops, when information is kept stored, and large loops, which pass through the Thalamus several times, being redistributed to several other parts of the brains. So, it is basically a mechanism cortex-thalamus-cortex-thalamus.»


About how torus loops function from a physical point of view and how they form large loops by which they interact with each other at resonant frequencies, is shown in my essay.

In addition, it is shown that a gravitational shell always forms on the interfaces between media, which forms turbulence vortices that are the source of energy for activating various processes.

«But, most likely, evolution began on the limits between these environments, where chemical clocks were on the threshold of survival. The reason is that the circulation within each of these environments tended to be non chaotic, but in the boundary, the difference in speed and dens ity of the solutions, caused the Reynolds number to be high.»

«In such view, more complex networks of chemical clocks could compensate for the difference in media, with the tendency to stabilize those that keep stable under turbulence.»


I wish you success in the contest.

Kind regards,

Vladimir

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Author Daniel de França Diniz Rocha wrote on Apr. 7, 2017 @ 16:12 GMT
Dear Vladimir,

due time constrains (besides, the voting ends today), I won't be able to properly comment your essay. It would take me a few more days for that, since right now By "properly", I mean, sharing some ideas and thoughts. I really enjoyed your essay. I hope we can keep in touch.



Vladimir Nikolaevich Fedorov replied on Apr. 9, 2017 @ 07:08 GMT
Dear Daniel,

Many thanks for the kind words about my essay and high rating.

Congratulations on the successful completion of the next stage of the contest.

I also «hope we can keep in touch.»

I wish you success in the contest.

Vladimir

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